JJ Riddell recommended Lisa to participate here. It turns out that JJ has been working hard in community activism since at least the 8th grade, which is when he and Lisa met. I'm grateful to JJ for connecting us as Lisa and I had a wonderful conversation together. We spent a few hours together and covered nearly every topic. We chatted for an hour or more over a cup of coffee and an ocean roll before going on record and then revisited a couple of those topics which you'll read or listen to below. And then we kept it going after the interview.
Our talking definitely left me with some food for thought. What can we do? Sometimes it feels so daunting, doesn't it? How can we express our concern and compassion in actionable ways? And how do we balance that with some levity? I think about this stuff a lot and I am trying so hard to encourage others to do the same through this project. Is it working? I hope so.
I'd like to offer a big thank you to Lisa for her time and candor and her willingness to listen to my perspective and thoughtfully engage in a difficult conversation. I'm sure you've noticed that not everybody is willing to do that.
LS: My name is Lisa Shropshire and I describe myself as someone who loves her family very much and I'm passionate about many things and [I’m] very much a disrupter.
ACT: What do people mean to you, individual to individual?
LS: A lot. I think that it's hard going through this life by yourself. And so, having someone that you can trust and rely upon and be there in good times and in bad times is extremely important. And that's one of the things that I worry about in our culture — and I think all cultures -- is loneliness. It's a big thing. Having individuals that you can rely on and hold close in your heart — very important.
It takes all kinds to make the world go ‘round and to keep it an interesting place. But some people are just noise in the background. I don't know that I'm one that likes everybody. I try to see the good in people and I think mostly there is good in a lot of people. My circle is pretty small, so the people that I do have around me mean a lot. And I try when there is somebody — or people, or a group -- that I don't agree with to respect. But I have to keep that at a distance because sometimes it gets to be too much. The noise gets to be too loud.
ACT: What concerns you about the state of the world and humanity? What affects you personally?
LS: I think life has gotten very complicated in many, many different ways. I think that there are these standards and bars that have to be met -- or we feel like we have to meet them. We live in this Instagram-able world and if you don't project a certain image, you can feel bad about yourself or insecure. That really concerns me for young people. With all the ways and all the technology that has made our life easier, I think it's made it a lot harder. It's made it a lot harder to develop real relationships. And I worry about that.
ACT: What inspires you or motivates you to do something about it?
LS: Suffering is hard for me to see. When I see a vulnerable population -- and I'm using that term loosely, whether it's kids or animals — if they can't do something to help themselves, it really motivates me to get out there and to try to help and try to affect change. When our son was in second grade, I was very involved in his school and his classroom; I was lucky enough to have the time to volunteer. It was hard for me to see kids in the classroom who couldn't afford to buy books at the book fair or to go on the field trip. And that really motivated me to get started in doing grassroots and guerrilla fundraising — to help somebody who couldn't, at that point, help themselves.
ACT: If community is our relationships with each other and the world we live in and our relationships are paramount, why are we struggling so hard to bridge the gaps and to consider everybody's needs with equity and compassion? What does that mean to you?
LS: In this culture if somebody asks you, How are you? it doesn't matter whether you just lost your dog, you're gonna say, I'm fine — everything's great. Are we really being honest with each other? Until we are, there's always gonna be a struggle because there's no vulnerability there. And that's hard for me. When I offer to help people, I really mean it. Do you need something? How can I help you? Whether it's just a level of politeness or what, I don't think we're honest with each other at all about the struggles in our life — the good times and the bad times. If things are going really, really well, you don't want to share because, Oh, gosh, do they think I'm bragging? But when things are really, really bad, you don't want to bring people down. I'm one [that if] you ask me how I am, I'm gonna tell ya. I mean, not to a perfect stranger... but I don't have much of a filter. And that's from years of therapy — you gotta get it out. I appreciate with my friends when they're honest when they have a struggle and we can talk about it. Because I think it makes it easier. We talk about struggles as a whole and as a society, but everyone has their own. And when you keep it all inside, that's not good.
ACT: What do you do with the larger examples of things that aren't being kept quiet, that are being talked about, but are still suffering consequences of being outside of the cultural norm? Why are we still struggling with gender disparity and transphobia and homophobia and racism and sex trafficking and domestic violence and child abuse? Why is there such a disconnect?
LS: Well, bad things happen. It's true. Child abuse — great example. I was abused as a child. And it's not a secret. It was bad — it wasn't terrible; people certainly have it a lot worse. But it wasn't talked about back then. At all. It was not talked about. There were no resources. And that defined a lot of who I am now. But I was lucky; my parents found the resources. Now there are systems in place. It still goes on, unfortunately, but there are places that kids and families can go to get help. Whether they choose to or not is a different story. Why it happens is a different story. And it can happen anywhere.
There's always gonna be struggles. And I think there are people out there that are trying and I think we are making some steps, but the world is a harsh place. I think every nonprofit wants to work themself out of business because they don't want their services to be needed anymore.
With child abuse, I think a lot of times abuse happens in a home because the parents — the guardian, the adult — is so frustrated with their own life and what's going on. Whether it's financial or mental health or whatever it may be, they don't have the resources to deal what they're going through, so they take it out on their kid.
ACT: It seems to me that at the core of all of the injustices is a lack of consideration for someone else because you can't see past your own shit. Can we popularize empathy? Can we get to the bottom of all it through some sort of — whatever works these days — social media campaign? The most important thing, the coolest thing, the thing that's going to get you the most social credit is to just give a damn about someone other than yourself. We can't teach every single person every single lesson in life. How can we beat this?
LS: I try to affect change where I can. It would be great if everybody could take a stand like I did with Jimmy John's, but it's not possible for everyone to do that. Even if it's baby steps. For some people, it is baby steps. For other people, they have means to help make change on a much larger level. But if everybody did what they could do, I think it'd be a tremendous change. If everybody said, This is what I'm gonna do today or This is what's important to me. If I can affect change and help one person or six dogs or whatever, that adds up. But I do think you're right. I think people say they want to help and they say that they do, but do they really? Does it get uncomfortable for them? It kind of has to get uncomfortable.
ACT: You can hope for something until you're blue in the face and it's never going to happen. What brings about change is effort and energy and working towards it. Do we want to change? And will we accept responsibility to make that change?
LS: Oh, change is scary for some people. Right? Yeah, we want to change and people can talk, but it's hard. It's hard to think of reframing the way that we live or the things that we do. And the perceived giving something up. Could we all go down to just one car? Or no car? Yeah, we can, but it's a shift. And it's a challenge. And I gotta tell you, a lot of people don't like change.
ACT: I'm tiring of listening to people claim that they want things to be different while everyone knows that change is hard. But you cannot do the thing — insert any of the topics we've talked about today — without sacrifice. How important is what we're stuck on? How important is what we're unwilling to give up? Versus how important is the change that could come if we did? How do we get through to people about that efficiently? There's not enough time to wait around for everybody to have their individual epiphanies. What we do matters.
LS: Like we talked about, I will no longer eat at a certain sandwich chain because the owner's a big game hunter. I don't believe in that. I voted with my dollars on that one. But I'm just one tiny grain of sand. Right? I think the question may be, How do you get a critical mass to make a small change? Straws — everyone in my family got their own personal, portable and bendable straws to carry with them. And you know what? Some of them actually use them. Which is awesome. I have one in my purse. I pull it out. I don't use straws anymore. Again, I'm just a tiny grain of sand. What's the movement to switch one small thing? And I don't know. How do you get a group of people to commit to making one small tweak to their daily routine that will show us change — that will have measurable results? I think that's it. I think once people start to see measurable results, it's like, Oh, okay. This really works! It's really hard when you're just one person. It's really hard.
When you see the wins — when you see, Oh my gosh, I had a hand it that — that's what keeps me going. How do you get a group of people to tackle one small issue and see that their efforts resulted in something good? Then you tackle the bigger one. And the bigger one. That's a tough one. Is it a community? Is it a neighborhood? Is it a school...? That creates a habit then, right? There's just so many things that need to be shifted. And when you look at 'em as a whole, I think it's Well, how can I make a difference in that? But when you can take it in small chunks that you can actually measure and see, I think that's what people respond to. That's what I respond to.
ACT: Do you have a sense of purpose?
LS: Yeah, I think I do. I want to make a mark on the world, but I don't have to do it in a splashy way. If I can do something to help make someone's life easier, better, or be there at that one time... maybe that's not a purpose. Maybe that's a goal. I think I was put on this Earth to address the elephants in people's living rooms. And I don't know why. Why are we closing a blind eye to this? Why don't we talk about what's going on? I'm the one that tends to bring that up. Maybe that's my cosmic purpose is to instigate change where change is needed. I genuinely do like helping people in whatever way that I can. But not for the fanfare, but just to be there.
ACT: Do you have any closing thoughts?
LS: This is hard! It is. You bring up some really good questions. I read some of your interviews and it's intimidating to try to articulate in a concise manner and hope that what you say makes sense to yourself and to other people. I do think that people — most, certainly not all — want to do better. And that's left up to interpretation what that means. Is it doing better for themselves? Is it doing better for the community? Is it doing better for their family? I think that people really do strive to do things in a better way. It's just left up to the individual to determine what that is. There's a lot of things thrown at us. I think a lot of us are jaded. We're dulled by everything — the negative, the negative, the negative. You feel like, What can I do? How can I affect change? I'm a grain of sand. What can I do? But I think people can. They can help. They can pick the battle. What's it gonna be? Try not to be everything to everybody. But just pick the one thing that's important to you and try to make it better.